ComeOn Connect

Discussion in 'Real Revenue Share Audits' started by Guard Dog, Dec 20, 2018.

Do you work with ComeOn Connect?

  1. Yes

    11 vote(s)
    91.7%
  2. No

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Will try

    1 vote(s)
    8.3%
  1.  
    Guard Dog

    Guard Dog Guard Dog Staff Member

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    Today we present you the Real Revenue Share Audit Report for ComeOn Connect.
    They have 17 brands:

    1.Blitzino
    2.Casinostugan
    3.CherryCasino
    4.ComeOn!
    5.EuroLotto
    6.EuroSlots
    7.Folkeautomaten
    8.GetLucky
    9.Hajper
    10.Mobilautomaten
    11.Mobilebet
    12.Nopeampi
    13.NorgesSpill
    14.Snabbare
    15.SuomiAutomatti
    16.Suomikasino
    17.SveaCasino

    For this report, we have chosen the ComeOn Casino, where we a have a 40% revenue share deal.
    We deposited USD 25 via Skrill and took the welcome bonus. Our starting balance was USD 50.
    SuccessfulDeposit.png
    WelcomeBonus.png

    We started playing some slots:

    Slot1-start.png

    Slot2-start.png

    Slot3-end.png

    In the end, we lost all the money deposited and then logged in to the affiliate system to check the statistics:

    Statistics-1.png
    Statistics-2.png

    The Net Gaming Revenue
    for the deposit of $25 (EUR 23.03) was EUR 5.24.
    Our earnings are 40% of that amount, which is EUR 2.10.

    So to summarize, the Effective Net Gaming Revenue (the amount of money deposited and lost) is 5.24/23.03=22.75%, which is very bad!

    Finally, multiply the advertised revenue share rate with the Effective NGR to see your real revenue share rate, e.g.:

    · 25 % = 5.69 %
    · 30 % = 6.83 %
    · 35 % = 7.96 %
    · 40 % = 9.10 %
    · 45 % = 10.24 %
     
  2.  
    BetOnlineUK

    BetOnlineUK Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Is it possible to do the test without the bonus to see if it is different?
     
  3.  
    Guard Dog

    Guard Dog Guard Dog Staff Member

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    We try to always take the bonus and do the test, unfortunately, we don't have the resources to do multiple tests per company at the moment. If you would like to do a second test we are happy to publish the results.
     
    MissExposé, gobo, Zuga and 1 other person like this.
  4.  
    BetOnlineUK

    BetOnlineUK Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I will look at in the New Year, I am just thinking that the bonus in some capacity may be messing with the figures.
     
    Guard Dog likes this.
  5.  
    Biti

    Biti Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Even with taking into notion that a bonus is taken, this result is extremely bad.

    Is it written clearly in their t&c? Otherwise it would be right to call them thieves.
     
    gobo likes this.
  6.  
    Stephen

    Stephen Affiliate Program Representative

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    Hi, guys,

    Yes, we know we have higher than average fee's on some of our brands. This is legacy from the acquisition of ComeOn by Cherry last year, and due to the recent migration, to avoid confusion, it was decided that the fees would remain the same. We are currently in talks with senior management about this, however I would like to point out that although our fees are higher, we have far higher conversion that a lot of our competitors, have a higher CLTV over all and retention is above average. We also spend a massive amount on non-affiliate advertising such as TV / digital etc which also helps us to acquire affiliate traffic as well as retain. All changes we purposed to make and have made were all discussed directly with AGD before the migration took place for their feedback and advice on how we moved forward.

    The bonus also makes a massive difference to this calculation in this example as well. As we deduct fees for some brands on GGW - inc bonus - so we would be deducting any fees on the higher amount.

    We understand there is a need for more fairness and transparency between all operators and affiliates and we are working towards having our program operate in this fashion. Please bear with us on this over the holidays and we will continue to work on this over the new year. We have been a platinum sponsored for many years and are always consulting management at AGD regarding any changes that we make in our program.
     
    MissExposé and Zuga like this.
  7.  
    BetOnlineUK

    BetOnlineUK Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Hi Stephen,

    Thanks for the prompt reply, I know that you do not shy away from any issues, but can you let us know what the true % rev share would have been if the bonus had not been taken please. This is an important factor for me because I can take the hit on an initial sign up offer if the rev share was a good deal higher on future deposits
     
    Zuga likes this.
  8.  
    AidanLCFC

    AidanLCFC Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    that is really bad, won't be pushing these much in the future. to be honest never really had any success with comeon in the past and this may explain it
     
    danniee and gobo like this.
  9.  
    Zuga

    Zuga Administrator Staff Member

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    yes we need to know the exact formula they use to calculate %, revealing all fees.

    For instance , if they claim admin fee, i want to know what exactly that constitutes so i know exactly what we are being charged for. And so forth for each specific type of deduction they empose.

    No bs, hidden fees, fully transparent breakdown of the revenue formula used.
     
    nibnab, pinkytoe, danniee and 3 others like this.
  10.  
    gobo

    gobo Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    All programs that rips off the affiliates with hidden fees and admin fees says the same thing. "we are having far better CR than our competitors bla bla bla". No figures at all backing up these kind of statements.

    We want to know exacly how NGR is calculated. What is the exact formula and how high are all the fees that you deduct before NGR? Also, why is the exact numbers not stated in the T&C? That means that you can change the fees however you like. That is rogue in my book.
     
    eenzoo, danniee and Biti like this.
  11.  
    bonustreak

    bonustreak Administrator Staff Member

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    Wowzers! No wonder we cannot make money here :( This changes my ad placement for sure.
     
    KasinoKing, danniee and gobo like this.
  12.  
    Biti

    Biti Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I agree.

    In the t&c should be mentioned how the commission is calculated exactly. With numbers, etc.

    This is just ripping business "partners" off and a crappy marketing pitch.
     
    danniee and gobo like this.
  13.  
    Bingostarr

    Bingostarr Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I have completely given up on these guys. After migration to comeonconnect I've magically dropped from four figure monthly average payments to 2 figures...and low 2 figures at that!

    Contacted them in September this year and was told:

    "Unfortunately, I do not know why your earnings have gone down in general. We have moved all players without them being affected by it and they remained on the same reward plans, but I am certain that they will play again like in the past."

    They never have...
     
    danniee and gobo like this.
  14.  
    gobo

    gobo Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Them "not knowing" why your numbers are down after the migration disgusts me. They know but rather not tell.

    It was the same with Videoslots - once we started asking about all the fees it takes time and they are not sure, and they are under-staffed, and they are on holidays, and they are busy with other work etc etc.

    And people wonder why there is so low trust in this industry. It is because of all companies like ComeonConnect and Videoslots.

    Why can't affiliate programs understand that it is the long term relationships that matter? We will all make more money in the long run if they were just fair.
     
    danniee likes this.
  15.  
    danniee

    danniee Affiliate Program Representative

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    Not impressed by these numbers. Not going to work with them anytime soon. The brands are not even that great that it would be worth it either.

    I wish programs weren't such shortsighted greedy @#$%. Oh well, with hundreds of programs I'll just move on to the next.
     
    gobo likes this.
  16.  
    Stephen

    Stephen Affiliate Program Representative

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    Hey, guys.

    @BetOnlineUK I've added a little breakdown for how it will work with and without a bonus to clear it up for you. I have rounded the amount deposited to €25 to make it easier to calculate and follow:

    With Bonus
    Deposit: € 25
    Bonus: € 25
    GGW: € 50
    Admin Fee: € 19.00
    NR: € 6.00
    RS: € 2.40

    Without bouns
    Deposit: €25
    Bonus: €0
    GGW: €25
    Admin Fee: €9.50
    NR: €15.50
    RS: €6.20

    @Zuga, as you well know we do not shy away from issue or explanations and I would like to direct you to the communication we sent to you in March with regards to our fees and the breakdown of such then. As stated previously, we are accredited here and as such have always been open with the team at AGD and have requested advice as needed.

    Our fees for Comeon Brands are 38% on GGW and include the following breakdown:

    7% JPC / 8% Transaction fees / 18% Game royalties / 2% player comps / 3% admin fee from GGW

    As mentioned we are well aware that they are higher than some of our competitors and unfortunately due to contractual obligations we are unable to break down the percentages further. The deductions at this time are subject to senior management, and although we can make our recommendations we do not have the final say. This is not a discussion that has only started since this post, this is a discussion that has been on-going since Cherry's acquisition of ComeOn!

    As stated above - we have no reason to hide this from you and are continually working to provide the best program possible. We are currently in talks with senior management with regards to these and will update the thread as and when we have more news.

    @Bingostarr - I am sorry to hear that you haven't received the support during migration that you should have and I agree, more investigation should have been carried out. I will PM you to get further account info and investigate this further.
    I would, however, like to note that no changes to calculations etc where made after migration and ALL referred players were migrated. If you or anyone has any questions about this or would like to have lists of all your migrated players, please PM me.

    @gobo - As stated above - nothing in our calculations etc have changed since migration, however, I agree that Bingostarr's case should have been investigated further which we will do.

    We are not making excuses for holidays and as stated we are trying to mitigate concerns - we responded as soon as we were notified about the thread - we are not ones to shy away from questions however as you must understand, its the Friday before Christmas and a lot of our senior management are already on holidays. Unfortunately, I doubt we will get the answers needed before the new year and we were merely trying to manage this forum and members expectations.
     
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  17.  
    Bingostarr

    Bingostarr Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Thanks for making contact Stephen. Now dealing with him to try and get to the bottom of things.
     
    Stephen likes this.
  18.  
    brett81

    brett81 New Member

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    Sorry about writing my first message here on a bit of a negative tone, but since there were some claims that I feel needs to be addressed further, I had to open an account. I'm an avid reader on the forum already, so thanks for the great content for the admins and all affiliate users (and casino reps alike).

    Comeon Connect Admin Fee of 38% on GGW is the highest I have heard of. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

    I think that is a very bold statement. I would like to know what numbers (data or research) are you using to back this up?

    I'm not saying this claim is false, but when using this as an argument over your own fee structure, backing the claims with numbers should be a standard thing.

    And other multi-brand companies that charge let's say, half of those fees are not advertising heavily?

    How are you measuring the "help" effect for the affiliate from advertising? In my opinion, there are two sides to this: When you have a lot of non-affiliate advertising, you have better coverage on the market by default. This could actually hurt the conversion for the affiliate, since there are too many players that search for gaming related stuff and already have an account on the brand in question. On these cases, the brand will get branding/retention for free from the affiliate, so I would say this is a more complex thing than just to jump into favorable conclusions.

    Again, when justifying this cost structure by these type of abstract claims, I think they should be be very well backed.

    You don't pay full fees to gaming providers when players are wagering with a bonus. Also, when justifying 18% on game royalties, it's safe to say that the real cost is not even close to that, let alone the adding this fee to bonuses.

    Also, why do you deduct 7% jackpot contribution fee from all wagers, even from non-jackpot slots? Usually, this is done on real contribution basis. Jackpot contributions vary, but average around 7%. Are you saying that you take this from all wagers to cover JPC's? Don't you think this is a bit too much?

    There is no transactional cost on bonuses (I assume you are talking about payment processing fees), and calculating 8% on transaction fees towards the affiliates is not ok, and you calculate all this from bonuses as well, so this breakdown seems a bit off.

    Please address these further point by point.

    Other than that, thank you Stephen for being transparent and responsive. I think the logic behind the free structure is ill-advised and I feel affiliates (and also competitors) should be respected more when making claims on conversion, CLTV, and retention. And further, these claims should be backed with proper data.

    Overall, I like the program, but since there is a healthy discussion around this, I wanted to take part. And as it is Christmas time, there is absolutely no rush to answer. This is not an attack on the program, but I don't like the fact that casinos can do this kind of stuff and you find out about these only when a watchdog entity makes their own calculations.

    Most of us promote dozens of brands and trust big operators like yourself by default. And I don't mean that you are scamming, but these fees and deductions are not something you can easily justify.
     
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  19.  
    gobo

    gobo Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Thanks @Stephen for replying to our questions. Even though I think your fees are way too high, I still appreciate you talking about it and now just put the lid on like Videoslots does.
     
  20.  
    CL-Ed

    CL-Ed Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Ding ding ding we have a new winner, or should that be loser? Well done Guard Dog for outing this.

    Stephen, good on you for being open and honest about the fees. But I'm sorry mate, the quote about polishing a turd comes to mind.
     

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