Affiliate forums for Casino webmasters are DEAD!

[mashed]

As 'anything goes', This is my rant or frustration post.
I have been in aff. marketing since 1999, mainly in adult, and the community there is immense. Now in iGaming, it's like winning the lottery to find people willing to share ideas or even chat casually. Why is that?

I may come off as an idiot, which would answer the question, but looking at the microscopic number of posts on this BIG industry forum makes me scared. What is going on, is this business dead? Where are all the action? Where is all the communication happening? I hope not on LinkedIn...

Am I wasting my time on a dead communication channel? Is this specific forum just doomed?

 

[AidanLCFC]

this ain't too bad here, the only one other i can think of is gpwa and that place is a joke. trouble is forums like this aren't ran for fun, they are ran for profit, gpwa being so bad on that front. they sided with snipe affiliate programs and bad practices over the affiliates they claim to represent. years ago i was one of the UK's biggest sports affiliates and was always happy to help people, yet you get people wanting a piece of your pie for free, people jealous and telling you you are chatting shit, and then full blown bullshitters. one i remember was some div moaning constantly moaning about an aff program closing his account, I then found he charged a large fee upfront and then not sent a single player in over a year. much more useful ways to spend your time imho. but as i said, this place ain't too bad and the owners do help affiliates and do useful things such as audits

 

[Kadabra]

actually been thinking about it as well. I am on the forums since 2014 i think, and when i joined i remember there were 4 forums and all where more active than what they are now. Two of those 4 are dead now (CPA and PAL) and even on the live ones there are much less communication going on that it was in the past.

i was thinking maybe the reason is that more activity moving towards big companies, the market is more stable and harder to penetrate, but not sure that is the explanation.

 

[euromill]

It seems everything evolves and so has Gambling Affiliate forums. I was one of the first sponsors of this forum in the day, under a previous regime. It's a little like comparing Apples with Pears, the industry has evolved, and I think there are now far fewer part times taking part in the industry, so perhaps less chat on people wanting to find out stuff. To the OP - not saying you are part timer by the way - I am at the moment FWIW. I think AGD is the premier resource these days and the audits are invaluable.

 

[preditor]

AGD has been great but some of the old veterans are more or less (including me) becoming more and more passive.
For me it has been more or less, the lack of interesting topics where i feel i can give some input on and it feels like most posts are ether "not getting paid" or some audit reports where the casinos are pure evil to their affiliates in terms of a RS this is actually a RS that.

SEO, Casino and all related to the industry has changed into something else, than what it used to be. The old school "morals" are longe gone with some casinos doing cross-marketing and payments issues etc.

Nowdays with all sort of apps and groups on Telegram, Whatsapp, Skype, Linkedin and many other "new" platforms, it´s almost like we "the old generation" have to learn and become the "young ones" = mobile this, mobile that.

I do not draw the comb over all young people but the world has started to evolve more into the homo sapiens first generation, sholders and eyez down -haha

 

[xecutable]

As 'anything goes', This is my rant or frustration post.
I have been in aff. marketing since 1999, mainly in adult, and the community there is immense. Now in iGaming, it's like winning the lottery to find people willing to share ideas or even chat casually. Why is that?

I may come off as an idiot, which would answer the question, but looking at the microscopic number of posts on this BIG industry forum makes me scared. What is going on, is this business dead? Where are all the action? Where is all the communication happening? I hope not on LinkedIn...

Am I wasting my time on a dead communication channel? Is this specific forum just doomed?

It's a combination of gazillion things including but not limited to: no more waves of hyped up webmasters believing this is the niche where the "easy money is", old timers either moved on, retired or simply spend more time outside, affiliate programs became way more hostile and these days quotas and account closing is as normal as breathing, some affiliates became big and have hundreds of employees and even shareholders can't be speaking on forums, regulations and over regulations, hostile affiliates chasing reps out of the forums, alternative forms of "instant communication" like discord, telegram and so on, the lack of integrity that just spread on, the ease of buying yourself a spot in any conference no matter how many people you've put out of business, the transition from fellow webmasters and colleagues to THE COMPETION aka THE ENEMY, the list goes on and on.

In addition many of us started using the internet in the late 90s, when communicating with someone on the other side of the world was mostly done with emails. It was fascinating to communicate with people from different continents, countries, regions. These days it's as easy as opening your whatsapp while sitting on the beach.

Change doesn't mean it's bad, and this isn't strictly tied to this industry or this forum. I know plenty of forums I used to use for sports, games, coding, that I haven't visited in 8 years and they probably see the same thing. I'm just glad I was part of that time where things were simpler and nicer (ok boomer).

 

[Mondiad]

Agree with you all. I guess times have changed and we should embrace it.

 

[KasinoKing]

A very SLIGHT variation on Mondiad's post:

Agree with you all. I guess times have changed and we should retire

KK

 

[TheGooner]

There are a couple of reasons I think :

1/ FUNCTIONALITY - RELEVANCE.
Been doing it since 1999, and so it's unlikely that I'll find much new on the forum, and indeed many of the topics are rehashing of topics / ideas / thoughts that were considered old hat a decade ago.

I've got nothing new to bring to you either - so I am as much of the problem too - but the truth is that there is little of help / relevance here for the experienced affiliate these days.

I think it would be / is helpful for a newbie - but I guess only if the old heads join in and help.

2/ DIVERSE OPTIONS.
As has been mentioned above, forums were king when forums were the only option for shared communication with a group - as the only other option was an email list - remember them?

Now there is facebook, twitter, discord, even instagram and tiktok - and there are all flashier and easier to make a splash in with a video or a meme - so they are more attractive to the newbie.

Meanwhile the forum sits here - full of information, full of potential lessons, and advice ... how the hell wants that when you could watch another cat meme or a dog playing with a ball???

---------------------------------------------

So the forum sits, gets viewed less and less, and molders away. I visit here once a month or so (almost for old time sake) - cast an eye over the titles and click/read a few before departing.

Hey - at least I posted this time ...
;-)

 

[AussieDave]

I'm just glad I was part of that time where things were simpler and nicer (ok boomer).

Ditto.

Are all these advancements better?

In some cases yes but in others, no. There was a time in this industry, much like a reflection of days gone by in real-life, where, a hand-shake (virtual or real) was a sealed deal.

The very old timers like myself, @TheGooner and others, we were here when it all started taking traction. Online casinos were akin to the explosion of Cocaine in the early 80's. I commenced in Feb 2000 but I knew affiliates who were established since 2000. These guys were making huge 6 figures with a few html sites and on shared hosting @ $10 p/m. lo-f'ing-l.

This was the gig back then. Fortunes on a shoe string budget.

Now (if your starting from scratch) you need a decent bankroll and expertise to be successful. And, even then you might bomb out. The competition is insane, and that's just the start of it.

If it was easy everyone would be doing it!

 

[AussieDave]

I should add that @TheGooner commenced in 1999.
CasinoMeister (Bryan) 1998.

Not a lot of us 'old timers' left these days

 

[payme1day]

A very SLIGHT variation on Mondiad's post:

Agree with you all. I guess times have changed and we should retire

KK

You retired years ago mate. You haven't done a day's work in 5 years. Apart from press autoplay on shonky old RTG slots. And attend 1/3 of the annual Meistermeets lol

I dunno if KK agrees, but old-timers like us have possibly 'settled' their aff sites to a point where they have filtered out the trash and use fewer but less problematic programmes, so have little cause for complaints or discussion.

The industry has levelled out now, more of the focus is on regulation than the old free-for-all when for example using YT, low-quality websites and banners along with quite generous affiliate deals, there was easy cash for many.

You have had consolidation, bigger structured affiliate businesses with very high CPA deals and there's not too much left for the sole trader or smaller operation, and that's without the operators' lower profit margins and increased costs taken into account.

I think the older ones have probably made their money and just tick over nicely, both those factors not really incentivizing the extra stress and work at this stage.

 

[mashed]

Hi everyone,

I appreciate you all taking the time to contribute to this discussion and provide your valuable insights. Your comments have been helpful and insightful and have allowed me to see this forum and the industry as a whole from diverse viewpoints.

@AidanLCFC, thanks for your frankness and your take on forum operations. It's true the dynamics have changed over time, and different forums have their unique strengths and weaknesses. I also understand the bitterness that comes with fraudulent accounts and practices, it surely puts a strain on us affiliates!

@Kadabra, I feel your observation is quite relatable. I’ve also seen the shift in communication and how things have slowed down. I agree that the dynamics of the industry could be shifting towards larger corporate entities, thus changing the usual conversations you used to have among affiliates.

@euromill, thanks for bringing up the evolution of affiliate forums. Years surely change a lot and it's true that the landscape is currently more pro full-timers. I appreciate your acknowledgment of AGD as a valuable resource and will surely look more into the audits.

@preditor, your nostalgia for the old times resonates with me. Your points about the emergence of newer instant communication forms and how they affect forums is indeed food for thought. The shift from traditional formats to mobile-centric platforms can indeed feel like a generational jump and I find it hard to catch up.

@xecutable, your lengthy and well-articulated response really paints a comprehensive picture of the situation. The evolution, competition, ease of global communication, and all factors you mention make sense and indeed have fundamentally changed the dynamics of forums and the industry itself.

@TheGooner, it's true that many options have surfaced and each with its own appeal, pushing traditional forums to the background. Your observation about the frequency of visits and engagement in the forum is a bit disheartening but it seems to be the reality that we now face.

@AussieDave, your trip down memory lane really brings back memories. The way things have changed, particularly the transition from low-budget high-profit models to complex and high cost ventures resonates with the path I’ve seen.

@payme1day, your outlook on old-timers having more settled routines and fewer issues surely makes sense. I understand that over time, we develop our mechanisms and cope with the industry's changing dynamics in our unique ways.


Again thanks to everyone who chimed in!

 

[robjmiller84]

this ain't too bad here, the only one other i can think of is gpwa and that place is a joke. trouble is forums like this aren't ran for fun, they are ran for profit, gpwa being so bad on that front. they sided with snipe affiliate programs and bad practices over the affiliates they claim to represent. years ago i was one of the UK's biggest sports affiliates and was always happy to help people, yet you get people wanting a piece of your pie for free, people jealous and telling you you are chatting shit, and then full blown bullshitters. one i remember was some div moaning constantly moaning about an aff program closing his account, I then found he charged a large fee upfront and then not sent a single player in over a year. much more useful ways to spend your time imho. but as i said, this place ain't too bad and the owners do help affiliates and do useful things such as audits

This environment doesn't seem too unfavorable. The only alternative that comes to mind is GPWA, yet that platform is quite laughable. The issue with forums like these is that they operate for profit rather than enjoyment, and GPWA is particularly lacking in that aspect. They have chosen to support shady affiliate programs and unethical practices over the very affiliates they purport to represent. Back in the day, I held a prominent position as one of the UK's largest sports affiliates and was always eager to assist others. However, you encounter individuals who wish to share in your success without contributing, people who envy your achievements and dismiss your insights as nonsense, and even those who are outright deceitful.

I recall one instance where an individual incessantly complained about an affiliate program closing their account. Later, I discovered that this person had charged a substantial upfront fee but hadn't referred a single player in over a year. There are certainly more productive ways to allocate one's time, in my humble opinion. Nonetheless, as I mentioned, this platform is relatively agreeable, and the owners genuinely aid affiliates by offering valuable services such as audits.

 

[Madz]

Ditto.

Are all these advancements better?

In some cases yes but in others, no. There was a time in this industry, much like a reflection of days gone by in real-life, where, a hand-shake (virtual or real) was a sealed deal.

The very old timers like myself, @TheGooner and others, we were here when it all started taking traction. Online casinos were akin to the explosion of Cocaine in the early 80's. I commenced in Feb 2000 but I knew affiliates who were established since 2000. These guys were making huge 6 figures with a few html sites and on shared hosting @ $10 p/m. lo-f'ing-l.

This was the gig back then. Fortunes on a shoe string budget.

Now (if your starting from scratch) you need a decent bankroll and expertise to be successful. And, even then you might bomb out. The competition is insane, and that's just the start of it.

If it was easy everyone would be doing it!

I have spoken to a few good people who did very well back in the early 2000's and it sounded so much better back then. I started to get into it about 2015-16 and just caught the arse end of the wave I think. Google rolled out all sorts of updates and added the extra ad space within 18 months of my starting off. Then came Sky stealing everyones earnings(mine included), then all the new rules and regulations and much tighter restrictions. All in all I think I may have been bad for this business, sorry guys

 

[AussieDave]

The only alternative that comes to mind is GPWA, yet that platform is quite laughable.

Yet you work for CasinoHex as an editor. CH holds private GPWA membership and displays the GPWA Seal.

I've held off from saying anything BUT your comments are like reading an AI bot's response. I'm personally tired of seeing your BS, so blocking you. If other members don't like reading/seeing this crap, maybe they'll block you too!

P.S. Nice generic photo

 

[AussieDave]

Seems CasinoHex.org is using the AGD forum to test an AI Bot.

If it goes pear shaped it wont affect their site!

Full marks for treachery, lads!

 

[Jops]

Only 5-7 years ago you could find your nische and be king. Now you get swarmed instantly by 20 competitors trying to do the exact same thing and copy you instead of doing their own thing. It's a complete joke. You see it in the slots review nische and you see it in the streamer nische. Back in the days you had a handful of streamers, many doing it for fun. Now there are 500 of them, all trying to make a quick and easy buck and only in it for the money. All fake bs.

 

[Lucy CBC]

Seems CasinoHex.org is using the AGD forum to test an AI Bot.

If it goes pear shaped it wont affect their site!

Full marks for treachery, lads!

Ha! Funny, I was kind of intrigued by this somewhat unusual style ... well, makes sense the trend reached this forum too. was inevitable I guess

 

[AussieDave]

@mashed - I've thought about your title post, least since it was 1'st posted. I think one of the issue is that unlike other industry affiliate forums, casino and igaming affiliates have had next to no support over the years. In fact, if anything, they've been sold out more often than not.

As an example... 14+ years ago now but the GPWA accepted sponsorship from a program, which, when myself and a couple of other affiliates dug deeper into who they were, all roads seem to lead to the Russian Mafia. The excuse given by Steven C (yes Michael's son) was some BS about not having the resources to run all possible checks. lo-fing-l. It took around 90 min or so for my buddies and I to run checks.

The private GPWA members were asked to vote in 2011 on whether or a not a program which was BUSTED red-handed unethically cross marketing and stealing tagged players, should have their sponsorship revoked. The vote came back as a deafening YES.

But what do you suppose happened?

Nothing. Michael C did a back flip, stating, this vote was only to gauge how members felt. No action was taken. One couldn't be blamed for wondering how much cash passed hands to get that result.

This severe disrespect for members continues today. Blue Chip Partners have just paid for Gold sponsorship. However, what they offer to affiliates is a JOKE, more so a total scam. BUT the GPWA have no issue taking that sponsorship cash.

The Current owner of AGD is far better, the previous owner in many cases, even when solid proof was supplied, the previous owner more often than not, sided with the crooked affiliate programs.

I think most affiliates eventually become disillusioned with how these places operate. And, see they are simply used as cannon fodder, and blips on a screen. A means to increase the owner(s) wallet size.

I don't want to slam the place I'm posting from. I prefer to see this as constructive feedback.

AGD of late is riddled with affiliate complaints about programs not paying. These are certified AGD programs. Emails from AGD staff go unanswered, or worse, AM's et al make promises, only the renege and break their word days or a week or two later.

This cheating, lying and basically unethical acts should NOT be tolerated. Yet it is!

EG - An ADG certified program who doesn't respond or who doesn't keep their word, should equate to being thrown into the RougeHouse. No if's. No but's. These actions by dodgy affiliate programs don't hurt the AGD staff because they're paid a salary. However it most certainly does affiliate AGD member affiliates, who rely on these programs to keep their promises and pay commissions.

People get sick and tired of the same BS and pocket pissing crap.