£1billion wiped off UK online gambling firms in ONE DAY as £2 betting limit looms

Discussion in 'Casino Industry Buzz and Terms Alerts' started by Online-casinos.co.uk, Nov 5, 2019.

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    Online-casinos.co.uk

    Online-casinos.co.uk New Member

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    What do we think about the very real possibility of a £2 stake limit in online slots, and possibly other online games too? Nanny state or protecting the vulnerable?

    Personally I think the focus should be on better background checks rather than a lazy blanket ban on high stakes play which punishes those who can afford it and can control themselves. Seems a bit illiberal.


    I can't post links so here's the text from the bingodaily.co.uk article:

    "Following a six month inquiry, the Gambling Related Harm All-Party Parliamentary Group (GRH APPG) has made some very strong recommendations for the UK gambling scene.

    Shares in UK gambling operators plummetted yesterday, with Ladbrokes Coral owner GVC plunging more than 10% and wiping over half a billion pounds from its value in just one single day.

    The MPs have demanded a stake limit of just £2 on slot-machine style games, commonly known as slots. This would be in line with th £2 maximum bet restrictions placed on Fixed Odds Betting Terminals (FOBT) last year.

    The report outlined a series of proposals aimed at tightening UK gambling regulation. The 11 key recommendations made by the MPs include limiting the stake in online gambling, new regulation to focus on harm prevention and the end to using credit cards for online gambling.

    Other recommendations were ‘affordability’ checks’ on gamblers and restricting VIP accounts and the incentives being offered by gambling firms to those customers that bet frequently

    UKGC “Not Fit For Purpose”
    There was also a strong condemnation of the UK Gambling Commission (UKGC). The group which was established in 2018 to investigate the impact of gambling-related harm, described the regulatory body as “not fit for purpose.” As well as calls for the government to “urgently” introduce new stricter legislation, the report called for a ‘smart statutory levy’ of 1% be introduced to fund research into gambling-related harm. The APPG also recommended that the commissioning of research be moved away from GambleAware and the UK Gambling Commission, and instead be transferred to independent UK research councils and a public health setting.

    Iain Duncan Smith, vice-chairman of the group said:

    ‘FOR TOO LONG, ONLINE GAMBLING OPERATORS HAVE EXPLOITED VULNERABLE GAMBLERS TO LITTLE OR NO RETRIBUTION FROM THE REGULATOR. WE CANNOT CONTINUE TO FAIL VULNERABLE GAMBLERS.’

    ‘I THEREFORE URGE THE COMMISSION TO LOOK INTO THIS ISSUE IN GREATER DEPTH. IT IS OUTRAGEOUS THAT THERE ARE NOT STAKE LIMITS ONLINE, THAT GAMBLERS ARE STILL ABLE TO GAMBLE USING CREDIT CARDS ONLINE AND THAT OPERATORS ARE ABLE TO CONTINUE TO OFFER INDUCEMENTS TO THE VULNERABLE WITHOUT PROPER SANCTION.’

    A UKGC spokesperson said of the report:

    ‘WE ARE DISAPPOINTED THAT THIS REPORT HAS BEEN RELEASED BEFORE WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE CHANCE TO GIVE EVIDENCE TO THE APPG.

    ‘THE REPORT DOES NOT REFLECT OUR CONSIDERABLE ACTION AND PROGRESS ON MOST OF THE AREAS OF CONCERN SET OUT IN THE REPORT AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO BEING GIVEN THE CHANCE TO OUTLINE THAT WORK TO THE APPG.’

    Gambling Firms Shares Plummet
    As news of the MPs report surfaced, markets responded with a mass sell-off of gambling company’s stocks. 888 Holdings lost almost 14% of its value in just one day on Monday, immediately wiping £91 million from the online-only gambling firm.

    Hardest hit, however, was the Ladbrokes Coral Group – GVC holdings plc (Lon: GVC), which saw a 10.5% decline in the value of its stocks, equating to a massive £547 million in lost value. William Hill saw a £230 million fall, Paddy Power Betfair’s owner, Flutter Entertainment saw its value fall by £217.5 million. Also hard hit was GameSys, which makes online slot machine games, who saw £78 million wiped from its value on Monday."
     
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    Batman

    Batman Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I actually agree 100% that people should NOT be able to use credit cards to gamble with.

    As for the limit on stakes well £2 a spin is probably over the average anyway, and from a business point of view not great. But overall shouldn't make much difference i say with trepidation.
     
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    Moonlight Cat

    Moonlight Cat Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Sorry but i am 100% Disagree. The money on credit card is the property of credit card owner. If he want to gamble with this money he have 100% right to do this.

    This is are part of the game. Gamble to credit, gambling loans, gambling addiction. This is the part of our buisness and we all know about this.

    Gambling without loans, credits and gambling addiction - this is impossible. Gambling can't be safe. Gambling this is entertainment based on risk. The same as jump with paratrups. Why this jumps so so exciting. Becuase people that do this have are chance to death.

    Some people like this entertainment - only becuase they may lost all.

    Goverment try to do impossible. They may limited bet to $2, they may restrict credit card. And what? The one and only result will be - gamblers go to another online casino / bookmaker outside UK jurisdiction. That's all.

    If somebody want to gamble - he will gamble. This is the golden rule of gambling.

    If somebody want to gamble with credit money - he will gamble with credit money. And this is one more golden rule of gamble.

    All this restriction is like to ban the sale of medical syringes and expect that this will defeat drug addiction.
     
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    Batman

    Batman Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    lmao

    "Gambling without loans, credits and gambling addiction - this is impossible. Gambling can't be safe. Gambling this is entertainment based on risk. The same as jump with paratrups. Why this jumps so so exciting. Becuase people that do this have are chance to death."

    Nice comparison. I think we are going to disagree, but everyone has their own opinion, nothing wrong with that.
     
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    Online-casinos.co.uk

    Online-casinos.co.uk New Member

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    They are definitely trying to sanitise gambling in the UK, that's probably a good thing - I agree with banning gambling on credit where possible, if you can't afford to gamble then don't. You can still sell all your possessions and place everything on the spin of a roulette wheel if you want, just not more than what you own. However if the stake limit is introduced even that might not be possible, I really think that is going too far - I don't play much but when I do I like to vary my bets and make some crazy spins, the thought of being blocked from doing this by a government that thinks it's protecting me from myself is just pretty offensive really.
     
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    Batman

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    I agree with pretty much all of that mate but if you see it from the government's point of view which is trying to appear to be protecting young and vulnerable then this is probably the only thing they can do.

    We all just accept things which doesn't help and it won't stop problem gambling completely. It could do some good overall and if you really want to play higher limits there will always be away.
     
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    Moonlight Cat

    Moonlight Cat Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    In Russia goverment banned all form of gambling payments: credit cards, debit cards, e-wallets e.t.c. All except BTC - because this is impossible. And ISPs block online casinos, sportsbooks and affiliate sites on regular base. The one and only results: angry gamblers who still gamble.

    Is this stopped anybody? The right answer is: no
    99.999999999999999999% players is still playing and more angry against goverment because they do they life harder. But they find another options to make deposit (midlemans, BTC e.t.c.). But this nobody stoped anyone.

    The one and only person in this world who may stop gambler is himself.
     
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    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    I agree with Batman - players should NOT be able to borrow to gamble (i.e. use their credit card).
    When I first started gambling online (2001) I ran up a big debt on my Credit card which took a very long time to clear - even with my "bonus hunting" techniques. It was a stressful time and painful having to pay interest every month.

    Personally a £2 limit on slots is not TOO bad, as that is about my normal limit on "traditional" games, and seems to be higher than what most people bet. But on some low very variance games I do sometimes bet up to £10 - but I can afford to lose relatively big amounts without affecting my personal life.
    I think around £5 would be a more sensible limit.

    However... for Table games like Roulette & Blackjack £2 is a total joke!
    Those games would be pretty much killed online if a £2 limit came in :(

    And then of course, what about the high-rollers? If casinos tell millionaires they can only be £2 a go, they are bound to go to non UK licensed and possibly unregulated off-shore operators which is not only a risk to them, but also the Government wont be getting any taxes from it! :confused:

    KK
     
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    Online-casinos.co.uk

    Online-casinos.co.uk New Member

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    I wonder if there's a lot of pressure coming in from land based casinos to pursue these changes to online casino gambling? Similar to what happened in 2006 in the US ..
     
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    danniee

    danniee Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Terrible decision imo. The UK market is already over regulated. A £2 limit will be the final straw for sure unless you're happy with 5 casinos to choose from with no perks or benefits. Meanwhile, the unregulated market will thrive. Gamblers want to gamble. No regulator will ever prevent that. Personally, I consider the UK market dead already. The player value is just too low nowadays and not really worth the effort so couldnt care less if they banned gambling altogether in the UK. Sick of all the compliance crap anyway. It's like people in the UK can't think for themselves and need the state to make all the decisions for them
     
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    riih

    riih Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    Typical nanny state. To be honest, I do agree that both limiting credit cards and max bets will do wonders for addiction problems. Of course current gamblers will not like it, and our UK business will be even worse, but future generations might be better off at the expense of less entertaining games.

    As a comparison, Finland is crazy about gambling to the unhealthy point. A big reason for that is the indoctrination that has started decades ago. The monopoly, Veikkaus, being advertised as the patron saint of all, and physical slot machines being literally in every grocery store you can find. When you grow up surrounded by that, it doesn't seem like a big deal to start gambling, and its all downhill from there for too many people.

    When they're surrounded by a depressing selection and low max bets, a majority will stick with that instead of finding an illegal offshore operator - or might even not be attracted by gambling at all = less people will gamble and presumably with lower amounts.
     
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    Batman

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    I think you'll find that this won't happen in its entirety. I think there will be maximum stakes on slots of £2 that doesn't sound too bad. As for other games, it won't be £2 for roulette for example.

    This is early days and just MPs asking for it, it likely will happen but there will be a huge consultation first to waste millions then a compromise of some sort.

    In the live UK casinos, there are no limits I know of? It was just the FOBTs in the bookies that were the target of the last big shakeup.

    After the FOBs reduced stake thing people still stand in the bookies but on their phones, playing roulette and slots via the bookies online casinos. This is just asking for more highstreet bookies to close, why would you stay open? It's a waste of time, money and resources.
     
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    danniee

    danniee Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I just don't see how the UK online gaming industry as we know it today will be able to survive a £2 limit. Already more and more operators are complaining about low value in the UK market and many have even pulled out. And it's not just the UK pulling crap like this. Sweden went from being the most lucrative market in Europe to the least lucrative. We can sit here and say that Gamstop, Spelpaus, credit card bans and SOW are good things, but the truth is that all these rules are killing our industry. It's as if the UKGC and all these idiots on their high horses need shit to do, so they constantly make up new ridiculous rules. There's no stopping them.

    I'll be perfectly honest, the way things are now I'd rather go back to how it was 2 years ago. Might not be the politically correct thing to say but I've said it. Unfortunately, this only drives everyone to a grey/black market so I don't see anything good come out of this anyway. People have been gambling since the stone age. It's in our DNA. I'm not just an affiliate, I'm a gambler at heart. I love gambling and I'm going to continue gambling whatever happens.
     
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    Moonlight Cat

    Moonlight Cat Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I am not British and don't have the right to critique your political system. United Kingdom is great country and British ia great.

    But as middle age man with some life expirience i may say. All politics is the same in all countries. People is the same. Politics play follow different way in different countries, but they have one mentality.

    UKGC is political body, tell me if i am wrong.

    We webmasters from all other thw world have one mentality. We want to create something. Gambling sites, space ships e.t.c.

    Politics don't create anything in any countries. And in all countries they try to show people how they important.

    UKGC tryed to show how they protect peoples interests, and don't matter if in reality this is make impact to buisness. UKGC members think about they own future political careers.
     
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    NDG

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    I'm against the £2 maximum bet and I'm against banning credit cards.
    Let the people decide what they want to do with their money or their credit.
    I'm against the whole nanny state mentality where they think that people aren't
    smart enough to make the decisions on their own, so the government needs to do it.
     
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    AmyWilson

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    Agree! They'll always try to find the ways around and other payment options
     
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    danniee

    danniee Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I just don't get this hate towards the gambling industry. People do all kinds of stupid investments. They lose all their savings buying shares, they spend ridiculous money injecting botox and silicone, they spend loads of money partying paying silly money for drinks, cigarettes, alcohol. Yet, god forbid if someone wants to gamble. Then all sorts of safety measurments must be imposed. What the actual f*** is going on? Like someone said, we are gamblers. Risk is part of the game. Are we going to forbid everything that involves risk? What kind of boring life is that. It's always the same, just because a few can't handle it or don't like it, we must ruin the fun for everyone else.

    I am all for regulation and self exclusion, but all this bullshit with SOW, KYC, 3 second spin rules, bet limits and whatnot is devistating. As a player myself it's not even fun anymore. They have completely ruined it. I'm actually more worried as a player today than I was 2 years ago. You're always waiting for this SOW thing to f*** you over and the bonuses and perks are almost completely gone whilst RTP has gone downhill, so I'm basically just losing more money today than I did before.

    Both gamblers and affiliates will probably need to look elsewhere soon. Western European politicians are on a crusade against anything gambling related (unless it benefits them or the state). Canada, the US, India, Asia, even Curacao sadly, seems like way better options these days.
     
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