WestCasino - Intro

[Daniel WestCasino]

Greetings to all you fellow Guard Dogs out there!

I’m Daniel, and I represent the WestCasino Affiliates Program. First off, let me say it’s a real pleasure and honour to be part of the AGD Community. I’ve been following you for quite some time now, and I’ve always been impressed by the quality and accuracy of your platform.

(As for WestCasino, the company was established early in 2018, and managed to cover a lot of ground in a relatively short period of time. We operate under two legal Gaming Licenses provided by MGA and UKGC, and we offer high-quality Casino products and services to our main targeted markets: United Kingdom, Germany, Austria, Norway, Finland, Canada, South Africa and many more.)

Ever since we started, we’ve placed a great deal of focus on our Affiliate Program, building durable and mutually beneficial partnerships, based on comprehensive marketing tools and a high level of adaptability, only to ensure maximum commissions for each one of our individual affiliates.

Here are some of the first advantages you can benefit from, after joining our program:

· Revenue Share up to 45%


· CPA & Hybrid Plans available


· Sub-affiliation available


· Exclusive promotional materials


· Real-Time data


· First Class Account Management


If you have absolutely any questions, don't hesitate to reach us at affiliates@westcasinoaffiliates.com, or contact me directly on Skype: daniel@westcasino.com.

To partner up, our Sign-Up form is available at all times.


High regards,

Daniel

 

[Guard Dog]

Welcome to AGD Forum, Daniel!

 

[MissExposé]

Hi Daniel! Welcome to AGD and thanks for the intro!

 

[AussieDave]

Hi Daniel, thanks for the intro, and welcome to AGD.

I'm sure other members will fire a few questions your way, too. Got a few for you myself. All in reference to the affiliate T&C's.

Firstly, this one is a concern, it seems to allow West Casino Affiliates to retroactively change anything within an already established contractual agreement.

1.2 WestCasino reserves the right to update or modify this Agreement by notice via message to your email address 5 days in prior to any changes being implemented and presented online at the site within the section of affiliate terms and conditions. Should you not agree to the changes you are required to terminate this Agreement in accordance with the terms within this agreement.

The other is the question relates to GGR fees and deduction:

2. Definition

"Net Revenue", calculated on a monthly basis, means the monthly Gross Revenue less costs, which includes but is not limited to: taxes, betting duties, third party commissions/fees for providing games and game software etc, financial transaction fees, bonuses, "loyalty rewards", rakeback, cashbacks and charge backs.

There's no mention of actual monetary figures of these "fees", "duties" etc., etc. Not even a % figure. Hypothetically, an affiliate could join your program, and the discover, by the time all the 'undisclosed' fees are deducted from GGR, the actually real commission received, is a patch on what they believe; what the program states, they'd be paid on signup.

NB - It also mentions "cashback" and "bonuses". How are these calculated if and when either or both are given, but then lost back to the casino? At that point (aside from maybe an Admin fee), neither constitute a 'casino loss'...

Affiliates these days expect 100% full disclosure. And, by not having the cost of these "fees" displayed: important information left out of a legal binding agreement, doesn't seem very transparent to me. Especially when, your affiliate program ensures all its bases etc., etc., etc., are crossed and dotted.

Also spotted this pearler:
13.3 In the event that a referred customer has had no activity for a period exceeding 24 months, this customer will no longer be deemed as your referral and you will no longer be entitled to any further Revenue Share from any future revenues created by this player.

The casino would not have this player, if the affiliate had not referred said player.

If the casino makes money from said "player", the casino needs to pay the affiliate their commission, regardless of the time period between player making a further deposit; their first deposit; any deposit; or anything which, and reiterating, makes the casino money.

Obviously things like this, make a huge difference to affiliates.

Edit:
Both AskGamblers.com and CasinoRunner.com claim you have NCO. Couldn't find it in your T&C's, but you don't mention the "fee costs" - maybe NCO was left out too...IDK???

All in all... There currently seems to be a concerning number of predatory practices within the T&C's of the WestCasino Affiliate Program...just sayin

 

[DaftDog]

Well spotted Dave. I thought AGD vetted programs before they were listed, or are affiliates expected to do this now on behalf of the forum?

 

[Guard Dog]

This program is in the 'Not Yet Evaluated Casino Affiliate Programs'

 

[DaftDog]

This program is in the 'Not Yet Evaluated Casino Affiliate Programs'

My bad. Did not notice the sub-forum.

 

[AussieDave]

This program is in the 'Not Yet Evaluated Casino Affiliate Programs'

If the program isn't evaluated yet, why is their banner displayed, no less, with Btag attached? The "predatory practices" I discovered above, weren't hard to find. Or does no one, staff or otherwise, check these (IMO) important factors. Instead, are "not yet evaluated programs" thrown up with tagging attached. Then later their T&C's vetoed...

Not my forum, so I don't make the rules. But AFAIK Andy never allowed it. Least not until a program's T&C's were inspected. If a program happened to commence an intro thread, then a Mod/Admin would post said program wasn't Verified as yet. And, tagging removed.

Didn't always agree with Andy, but on this rule, I most certainly did

 

[BetOnlineUK]

Both AskGamblers.com and CasinoRunner.com claim you have NCO. Couldn't find it in your T&C's, but you don't mention the "fee costs" - maybe NCO was left out too...IDK???

I did see this on their FAQ page, but it is vague.

DO NEGATIVE BALANCES CARRY OVER?
We offer Negative carry over policy.

 

[Daniel WestCasino]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the welcome and interest shown in our program.

I will jump right into it...

I can assure you there’s absolutely no reason to be concerned about the first
paragraph, it’s a pretty standard clause meant mostly to protect WestCasino
Affiliates from fraud and T&C abuse. It is also not retroactive, we are compelled to
announce any changes at all, five days before implementing them – so far, this has
never been the case.

As for Net Revenue, we calculate it the same way all of our Affiliates do. It would
prove quite hard to approximate a % figure since players have different patterns,
claim different type of bonuses etc. I can, however, assure you that aside from the
standard Admin fees and the Bonus cost, there are no additional “duties” at all.
Needless to say, each individual Affiliate has access to his Net Revenue through our
platform at all times.

Lastly, the NCO part... In my personal experience, whenever you come across a
program offering No Negative Carryover straight off the bat, you should strongly
research them first, cause in 9 out of 10 cases, it’s just too good to be true and
eventually a smokescreen. To answer your question, yes, we do like to start our
partnerships with negative carryover for the first month, to be able to get a clear
idea of the performance and quality of the traffic. Based on these preliminary stats,
we can renegotiate (might even remove the NCO) and if we started with a revenue
share deal, then we move up to a CPA/Hybrid Deal.

Now, I understand your concerns and the utmost importance of details in affiliate
matters, and that’s precisely why I’m here, available at all times for any additional
info or queries you might have. In full disclosure, the current Terms & Conditions
present on the Website are slightly outdated (I admit), to be more specific, they
have not been updated since the initial launch. The other aspects you have
indicated are part of these outdated terms, and I will have them cleared and/or
brought up to modern standards in the shortest time – and notify all of our partners
5 days prior.

Thank you for your input & best of luck,

Daniel

 

[AussieDave]

@Daniel WestCasino

Thanks for getting back to me on these points raised.

I can assure you there’s absolutely no reason to be concerned about the first
paragraph, it’s a pretty standard clause meant mostly to protect WestCasino
Affiliates from fraud and T&C abuse. It is also not retroactive, we are compelled to
announce any changes at all, five days before implementing them – so far, this has
never been the case.

With all due respect, I've been a casino affiliate for 19+ years. If (over all these years) I got paid $100 every time an AM rep et al told me... hey don't concern yourself with this "term" or that "term", it's a standard clause to protect us against x, y, z. I'm not a lawyer, I'm guessing your not either. But, a pig in a tuxedo is still a pig.

Just like an affiliate contract is still a legal binding agreement.

Ironically, 99.999% of the time these type of clauses always favour the program. Hence, the way this contractual clause is written, is a concern because there is the potential for this "clause" to be used, regardless of reason. In which case, if the affiliate doesn't agree with future changes to said T&C's, then not only does the program garnish their players, but also ALL future rightful earning too.

As for Net Revenue, we calculate it the same way all of our Affiliates do. It would
prove quite hard to approximate a % figure since players have different patterns,
claim different type of bonuses etc. I can, however, assure you that aside from the
standard Admin fees and the Bonus cost, there are no additional “duties” at all.
Needless to say, each individual Affiliate has access to his Net Revenue through our
platform at all times.

I'm guessing you haven't read the Video Slots affiliate threads on AGD, yet. To bring you up to speed... In 2014, VS removed most of the "stats" data from their affiliates backend. They promised to reinstate said "stats" 2 weeks later. However, that was just BS... It took a further 3+ years, and being thrown in the RogueHouse here on AGD, before they agreed to reinstate the "stats".

In addition, VS used a similar excuse as you have above, to why they couldn't provide a list of monetary GGR deduction fees.

The truth finally surfaced to all their undisclosed deduction fees, these were the results:
https://www.affiliateguarddog.com/community/threads/videoslots-affiliates.12693/

25% = 3.08%
30% = 3.70%
35% = 4.32%
40% = 4.93%
45% = 5.55%

Spin Dr it how you want, BUT affiliates have a right to know the monetary deductions which will be subtracted from GGR, to give NGR.

In all the years I've been an affiliate, if and when you come across a program who wont disclose their GGR deduction fees etc., etc., or aren't willing to be 100% transparent with those fees and deductions, then that's one-red-flag you should worry about.

Lastly, the NCO part... In my personal experience, whenever you come across a
program offering No Negative Carryover straight off the bat, you should strongly
research them first, cause in 9 out of 10 cases, it’s just too good to be true and
eventually a smokescreen.

IDK how long you've being an AM, but I can assure you, NCO is not a common thing, least not these days. Bundling maybe, but certainly not NCO. More often than not, most programs choose to have a High Roller Policy. By which, if a player wins more than $10K in a given month, that player, and that player alone, is placed into corral.

Meaning: The NCO for that player, is garnished back by that player alone. It doesn't affect any other player tagged to the affiliate. It's a fair trade off, certainly far fairer that expecting NCO of a high roller, to be footed by ALL tag players of an affiliate.

In closing, maybe you could to chat to your boss about the GGR fee disclosures. I can assure these days, most affiliates expect 100% transparency on these deductions

 

[AussieDave]

Spotted this over at GPWA:
http://www.gpwa.org/forum/westcasino-affiliates-delayed-payments-249044.html

Seems like just another under-funded, poor man's White Label casino operation.