Ultrapartners - No depositing, only high withdrawals by player in stats, how is this possible?

Tupee

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I have several problems with an affiliate program accredited here, and one is qite odd, especially if I consider the things happened before. I would like to know your opinion on this before I make a feedback about them. I would not like to mention names yet.

So just a little history: payment delay with odd reasons happened before, but was resolved years ago, and after that the payment arrived all the time. Usually I earn 100-200€ with them. In january, however, comission started rising significantly to a record 750€ at this program for me. Interestingly, the amount disappeared from the payment order by february. No amount as pending to be paid, no amount on the balance owed. What the hell? The payment was not sent, and days after the deadline I emailed them. After sending several emails about what's going on, they finally sent the amount, but the procedure wasn't smooth and there were some odd moments in the case again, for example receiving a notification that the amount was sent, when actually nothing arrived again.

And then, just by interest, I checked february stats, because the comission was fluctuating, and I found very strange things. It is especially strange if you consider this disappearance of the payment this month. So, what I found is, there were higher than usual comission amounts this month as well, however, from a different tracker, where no deposit ever came from, there were even 3 withdrawals for high amounts for this month (450€ , 30€ and 330€). I wonder how this is possible? The account of the player was created years ago from my default tracker that I hardly used. Never a deposit, but this month when my comissions are rising, the player makes 3 withdrawals for high amounts. After a month when the record comission disappeared and was not paid. Don't you think this is strange? I know players are given free chips somethimes, but in connection with this casino I never noticed free chips given, only free spins, and not high amounts, and these bonuses usually have a limitation if no deposit was made. There is a cap, you cannot withdraw more than that. Yet this player could even withdraw unusually high amounts for a free chip or spins, and he could do it 3 times, in spite of the cap. Provided it was a free bonus. If not, I don't even understand where the player had money from when no deposit was made. The VIP conditions are listed on their website, based on that, a basic, non-depositing player can not even get free spins, though.

I would like to know your opinion. Is this a manipulation of stats? What do you think? See screenshots of stats attached.
 

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ddm

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probably more helpful if you name the operator.

following, looks mega-sketchy.
 

AussieDave

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Agree with ddm, this is mega-sketchy. Looks like someone is screwing you, mate!

Best way to get this sorted, is to call the program out.

Trying to resolve this sort of BS, privately, never ends in a favourable outcome. More than likely they'll just keep dicking you. Whereas calling the program out, they are scrutinised publicly, too much to risk for them, to try and play games, then.
 

Tupee

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Ultrapartners.

Previously, as mentioned, I had issues with payouts that simply did not arrive, or even more: disappeared from payment order. Already in the days when they were platinum members. I found how they managed the payout problem a way that would not correspond to an accredited or platinum member, but as I was always paid in the end, I decided to keep it as my opinion and not to mention it. Just in brief: they came up with reasons that was not possible based on their terms, for example. Etc. However with these oddities in the stats added, I decided to ask about this problem here, too.

Have screenshots and live chat archives so I can provide more if you want. I sent them a notice about this oddity in the stats, too. Have not received reply though as it happened yesterday and during weekend there is no support I guess.
 
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KasinoKing

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Is this a manipulation of stats?
It depends.
When you say no deposits - is that none EVER on that tracker?
Or just none in the current month?

Some players deposit and forget or play for months, making loads of profit and numerous cashouts from a single deposit - I have done this myself several times!
But if it is no deposits EVER - then something must be off.

Never worked with that operator, so can't comment further.

KK
 
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Tupee

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Noone ever on that tracker deposited and only 1 signup on that tracker since I registered for the affiliate program, that I never really used as I remember. See the photos below.

Moreover, I did some research now among my stats and archives. I registered to this affiliate program sometimes in 2016 or 17. Don't know for sure as the welcome email got lost, but surely after 2015. The first banner from them appears on my site in 2017. Now consider this what I found and check the attachments below:

- This tracker concerned (ending in 7) had only 1 sign up since I am a member. See the stats below.
- That only 1 signup happened in february 2020, when I was not promoting Ultrapartners casinos! I have checked this in my site archives. I have a bonus archive on my site, and a banner from Ultrapartners is included, but for a different tracker, since 2017.
- As I remember, I never really used the tracker concerned. I see from my archives, that a promo was provided for me with this tracker by my manager in march 2018, but I never used that promo as I remember, and surely not in 2020, when I did not advertise their casinos at all.This tracker concerned is my defult account tracker anyway, but I used a custom tracker all the time for a custom promo. That is the tracker ending in 0 on the photos, where you can see a lot of member signed up. That photo shows all my trackers used.

So someone signs up through a tracker that very likely I never used (as I can remember and based on my archives). Only 1 person ever for that tracker (as you see on the photos below). And if you check the stats below, no clicks or whatsoever arrived to that tracker, only that 1 single registration. Never deposited (also on the photo). And this month when my comissions are rocking and after a no payment issue for last month for a high comission, they withdraw multiple times, high amounts. Without depositing. This is weird.
 

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Tupee

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Haha, and even 1 more today. Check the stats attached. This is incredible.... I wonder what reason these guys will come up with.

By the way, I examined my affiliate account more carefully, and I noticed that you cannot check activity in the stats by player. That means in case a cheating is going on indeed, and for others they created fake player accounts on trackers where there are real depositing players as well, the cheating can never be detected. Simply because what you will see at the end of month is that you have 1000EUR deposits, and 900€ withdrawals, but it won't be listed which player transferred how much in and out. The max detail in the stats will be the transfers by trackers, but not players. Maybe in my case it revealed because I never used my default tracker and they created the fake account on that. This is a hypothesis of course, but in case this is a cheating, it can be quite serious.
 

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Tupee

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The affiliate staff replied today to my concerns. I just attach the live chat copy for you to read what they wrote. Actually no reason given for the question how it is possible the player could withdraw multiple times without depositing.
 

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Jean Bernard

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Hello

we are looking into this, it looks like a win from a free offer, we will advise shortly after checking with program admin

Best Regards.
UltraPartners.com
 

ddm

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"I checked" <- you said this in live chat . seems like you lied.
"we are looking into this" <- you say this now once this makes the public domain

very sketchy.

Also, genuine question Is Jean Bernard your real name? I can't find you on linkedin. In fact I can only find 1 ultrapartners staff member on linkedin.. seems weird.

#alarmbells
 

Tupee

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"I checked" <- you said this in live chat . seems like you lied.
"we are looking into this" <- you say this now once this makes the public domain

very sketchy.

Also, genuine question Is Jean Bernard your real name? I can't find you on linkedin. In fact I can only find 1 ultrapartners staff member on linkedin.. seems weird.

#alarmbells
I have opened a complaint about them at Askgamblers, asking the staff there to investigate this. I wrote into the complaint that I thought about the possibility that the wins are from a free chip, but because of the free chip cap and withdrawal rules it seems unlikely.The Ultrapartners staff read that complaint and it was after that they came up with that answer. Until that point they were silent. For example, on Monday, Jean Bernard wrote me anygrily he is investigating this, after I wrote here to the forum. Then silence for days. Once the complaint appeared at Askgamblers, they appeared again on the scene with this free chip stuff. But until then nothing happened. See the screenshot below.

But in spite of what they say, the other side of the story is that I did not advertise them last year when that mysterious registration happened. I checked my archives. Here is the video about it: 4shared.com/s/f5V9XYpawea (sorry for the crap hosting). I save my bonus list on every update, and I only have 1 list, plus an archive, but I checked that, and there the link to their casino has a different tracker, too. I already stopped promoting their casino well before my first issue with them in 2019, I withdrew their promo sometimes in 2018. Because the bonus that I advertised was not issued for the players. So I dropped them. Moreover the link that I used was a custom link and different, all visible in the stats posted. So how is it, that I do not promote them, especially not the link concerned, yet there is a registration from that link (!!! but no click!!!), only that one ever, and nothing happened with that registration, but now when I earn well, someone starts withdrawing from there. And it is still happening at the moment, I am earning this month as well, but the withdrawals are going on. This is just all too weird. Anyway, it is not the problem, that the withdrawals are there, because yes, I know some players win, some players loose. But all this happening along with this background that I described, that makes this hole case incredibly suspicious.

I don't mind now anyway what will happen. I won't advertise them any more, that is sure. I am glad this case could be mentioned, everyone who reads it can draw thier own conclusion.
 

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Tupee

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LOL
Status update from this morning:


Okay, so according to Ultrapartners somebody won on the mysterious tracker. Very interesting, that the player did not withdraw in one lump sum, but is doing it in parts. What a coincidence, these parts withdrawn are never too big, never too small, just about the same as my actual earnings at the particular moment, see the attachment.
 

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Insider

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LOL
Status update from this morning:


Okay, so according to Ultrapartners somebody won on the mysterious tracker. Very interesting, that the player did not withdraw in one lump sum, but is doing it in parts. What a coincidence, these parts withdrawn are never too big, never too small, just about the same as my actual earnings at the particular moment, see the attachment.

Seems that not much interest is here what UP are doing and no word from administration regarding ?

Only 3 affiliates have comment it.

As an affiliate platform who advertises with partners, one also have a certain responsibility and interest about what their partners do and how they act.

The alarm bells should go off for every affiliate when you see these stats.

It's too obvious what is happening here.

Something stinks a lot and how Dave already mentioned they're kidding you.

I say this because we have already experienced a lot in this business and we know that some people and responsibles are able to manipulate in different ways.

This is no consolation for you but i still hope that it will somehow turn out well for you.

Eeven if they take care of it, the suspicion of manipulation remains into our heads.

This topic and reaction of Ultrapartners has shown me never to become a partnership with Ultrapartners.
 

Tupee

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"This topic and reaction of Ultrapartners has shown me never to become a partnership with Ultrapartners."

And you still didn't see the details about how the manager lied on chat when I inquired about my missing payment during the years. Maybe later I will open a separate thread about it in the section dedicated for Ultrapartners, becasue I have clear evidence for misleading in that case, and it would be alone worth a discussion.

"Eeven if they take care of it, the suspicion of manipulation remains into our heads."
The same here. These stats are just so suspicious that it is unlikely any explanation would satisfy me.

Anyway, they replied already elsewhere. However it is as hazy as I expected. No specific explanations, as if they did not really check anything just came up with something to reply.

"The influence of former players' earnings through affiliates no-deposit offers (free spins, free chips) or offers from retention and conversion agents is very visible on non-active accounts.
This is one of the many reasons that affiliates are advised to continue to send more players.
This is exactly what happened here.
Best Regards
Ultrapartners.com"

They did not come up with anything specific. Just want to push the problem over my activity, as a no deposit bonus advertiser. That is true, I advertised them with 20 free spins back in 2017 for a short time, but for god's sake, what does that have to do with this recent situation? As it is visible from the stats, even with such a promo that run for a short time, I referred players to them who are still playing and bringing profit (not recently though, since this mysterious player appeared). So it is not true at all that the recent problem is related to the fact I am a free bonus advertiser. Using my activity as a reason is totally a false approach in this case. And it is just ridiculous they still think I will send them more players.

Here is the next one the replied today:

"We have looked into this case, there is a WD request from a NDB offer which is under your account, please note the request is still pending.
If it will be approved then the status of your earnings will remain as is, if declined the WD amount will be refunded to the player and to your account as well.
We are pushing to speed the case in order to solve this issue.
Please be more patient, it will be resolved by the end of the week."

Seeing is believeing I could say. And hey, what "a WD request" do they talk about? This week it is the 6th amount withdrawn since the suspicious player appeared on the scene, last time withdrawing an amount that equals to my comission amount at the day of that withdrawal.
 

AussieDave

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@Tupee - just returned today from a 10 day vacation. DDM calls it pretty clear. Conflicting stories from the AM at Ultra-Crap-Partners. The "please be more patient"... lol. That just takes the cake.

Toss these clowns to the curb, if you haven't already.
 

leah_shepherd

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Hello

we are looking into this, it looks like a win from a free offer, we will advise shortly after checking with program admin

Best Regards.
UltraPartners.com
Hello Jean!

Could you please send me your email address or write me here? I have something to discuss with you.

Looking forward to hearing from you!
 
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