Recent Processor Losses and Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates

Discussion in 'Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates' started by Nicolas-Johnson, Mar 31, 2011.

  1.  
    Nicolas-Johnson

    Nicolas-Johnson Affiliate Program Representative

    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    Recent Processor Losses and Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates

    This is a quick announcement to let our esteemed affiliates know that we are going to be absorbing the recent processing issue loses.

    None of our affiliates will lose a single penny due to this issue. As a large, stable operator we are able to absorb financial losses much easier than some of our smaller, less stable competitors.

    If you have any questions as how this might affect future processing for your players, feel free to contact me, I'm here for you!
     
  2.  
    josh

    josh Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2009
    warning...

    Warning no payment

    Just thought I would lt you guys know to beware of these guys... I am owed a fair sum for some time now with no sign of payment...

    j
     
  3.  
    warrichpk

    warrichpk Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    72
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2010
    @josh are you very sure that these guys are not trustworthy?
     
  4.  
    zuga81

    zuga81 Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    41
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Im very curious to hear what Nicolas has to say about this.

    thanx
    CBG
     
  5.  
    josh

    josh Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2009
    Yes warrichpk,

    It's considerable monies owed... so it's hard to mistake.....
     
  6.  
    Daera

    Daera Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    291
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Hi Josh,

    I was wondering if you could elaborate a bit. What is the reason they give you for the delay? Is there any dispute about if this is owed to you or not on their side? When was this money due to you? How late is it?

    I've worked with Nicolas for many years, and know that he is usually very reachable and very easy to communicate with.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2011
  7.  
    josh

    josh Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2009
    Hi Daera,

    I also have worked with Nicolas for many years.. he is apologetic about the delay... the debt is 6 months plus and I am told its lack of funds... they did send me a few small amounts via western union some months back but nothing close to what is owed...

    j
     
  8.  
    verboomC

    verboomC Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2009
    No reply from Nicolas?
     
  9.  
    Daera

    Daera Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    291
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Yikes! That doesn't sound good. Thanks for the reply.
     
  10.  
    zuga81

    zuga81 Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    41
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    maybe forum admins can notify him about this thread.
     
  11.  
    Nicolas-Johnson

    Nicolas-Johnson Affiliate Program Representative

    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    Yes we have an outstanding balance toward Josh. It is our fault, and I will make no excuses. We are looking to settle our balance with Josh in the most timely fashion possible.

    I have had reassurance from my superiors that though late, this affiliate will receive full payment. I can understand if other affiliates would rather wait on the sidelines or even take precautionary steps while this situation gets resolved.
     
  12.  
    zuga81

    zuga81 Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    41
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Hi Nicolas,

    dont you think your original post was misleading then ( although i know u referred to the most recent happenings )?

    If you are that large and stable then you shouldnt have any prob paying whats owed.

    just my two cents

    CBG
     
  13.  
    zuga81

    zuga81 Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    41
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    so im very curious to know if josh got paid ... any update on this ?

    CBG
     
  14.  
    josh

    josh Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2009
    Nothing as yet but they have been in contact and told me that payments will start on the 10th of next month (June).
     
  15.  
    bonustreak

    bonustreak Administrator Staff Member

    Messages:
    3,889
    Likes Received:
    346
    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2006
    Very alarming if you cannot pay large sums to affiliates! This means your not a large company with financial stability! I really hope that Josh has taken down your links. I cannot even think of what would happen if a player I sent to you won big......

    Josh keep me informed of this please....
     
  16.  
    zuga81

    zuga81 Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    41
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    did u get the money yet?
     
  17.  
    Aussie-Dave

    Aussie-Dave Former AGD Member

    Messages:
    684
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2007
    Hi All,

    I don't nor never have promoted Bet Phoenix.
    However from what I've seen of Nicolas around the forums over the years, it's certainly out of character for him to intentionally BS.

    I agree Josh should be paid. Frankly this issue should not have been allowed to continue to this point. On the flip, Nicolas is an employee and it's the owners who call the shots. Granted Nicolas could resign but like you and I, he too has commitments - maybe even a family to support.

    Nicolas is the voice of the affiliate program but in-retrospect, and as I've mentioned above, he takes his lead from the owners.

    We're all facing tough times and most of us are stressed not only over current day to day problematics but also longer term issues which may see our livelihoods from years of hard work go down the S bend.

    My point is, whilst I understand people have every right being upset with Bet Phoenix; especially Josh, I sincerely believe chewing on Nicolas for decisions out of his control is maybe not a fair call.

    I can only imagine he's between a rock and a hard place right now.

    On one side, affiliates are asking wtf?
    Whilst on the other, the Owners of Bet Phoenix are probably saying do this, say this or in this case, say nothing.

    Just my 2 cents worth.


    Cheers

    Dave
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2011
  18.  
    zuga81

    zuga81 Affiliate Guard Dog Member

    Messages:
    41
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Hi Dave,

    i do understand where you are coming from. However things aint that simple.

    Nicolas is representing this brand so he should be held responsible for everything he said here and also for the doings of betphoenix. I would be more than happy to talk to the owners and ask them the same questions. But I dont see them here...

    Josh obviously made them money and they are taking his players and deposits. So they should pay him fair and square. They are making profits after all, and they spent money on the latest platform shift.

    So my question is how come they dont have money to pay this affiliate. And if they can not pay him, then all other affiliates are in danger too, and its only matter of time when they all gonna get shafted.

    Also i can see that many promises were made to Josh and up to this date nothing has happened.

    So it is fair to say they r running a BS operation here with zero transparency
     
  19.  
    Aussie-Dave

    Aussie-Dave Former AGD Member

    Messages:
    684
    Likes Received:
    1
    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2007
    I don't disagree with you - everyone should be held accountable for their actions.

    However, with all due respect, taking a black and white line on this, when clearly Nicholas is the mouth piece for both Bet Phoenix and the owners, is a hard call.

    If you look above you'll see Nicholas added a "thankyou" to one of your posts. That tells me he personally agrees the "Josh" issue makes his original post a farce. It certainly gives affiliates every right to ask wtf is going on.

    The rights of affiliates to expect transparency from Bet Phoenix or any program for that matter is justified. Every affiliate partner should always be told the truth no matter how bad it may be - honesty far outweighs being led up the proverbial garden path, hey!

    I don't see it happening either, mate.

    Reiterating, if Nicholas has been told (ordered) not to make any further comment, then as an employee of Bet Phoenix, that's about what is likely to happen, no comment!

    Did I say Josh should not be paid? No I did not. I said:

    .

    Personally, Bet Phoenix and their actions should be considered dodgy at best, at worse, possibly blacklisted if not rogued.

    I disagree. Things are as straight forward or as complex as people wish to make it.

    Facts I've drawn from this thread:

    • Josh is owed affiliate payments and has been stalled for months.
    • Bet Phoenix has not be truthful in their dealings with affiliates.
    • Whilst Nicholas is accountable, he is not the owner(s) of Bet Phoenix.

    What should happen is the owners of Bet Phoenix should release a public statement. Instead of allowing Nicholas to wear the brunt of affiliates displeasure. They should also pay Josh in full ASAP - even to the point of an interest which would have be earned if the amount was paid months ago.

    Nicholas should either pull all stops out to make sure these issues get sorted and the owners of Bet Phoenix face up to their responsibilities. If the owners wont do this, which seems to be the case, if I was Nicholas I'd be resigning at that point.

    Reiterating though, Nicholas is ONLY an employee. So holding him responsible for Josh not being paid, and for what he's (I assume) been told to post (or not to post) in this thread, is what I was trying to explain that people should focus their anger at the owners of Bet Phoenix and not Nicholas.

    If this issue bothers people this much then instead of talking, take some action. Blacklist them and take a combined stance, stating this is not acceptable.

    It's not my intention to be obtuse - I have nothing to gain or lose here.

    However the facts are on the table now.

    Asking for comment from Nicholas when it's more than likely he's been gagged by the owners of Bet Phoenix, to me seems like a waste of energy that could be spent on forcing the issues. Take a combined stance against the owners of Bet Phoenix by blacklisting their program and gaming venue(s) with immediate affect.

    Blogs are great way to get immediate impact. Do this and I'm sure the owners of Bet Phoenix will reconsider their current status quo, not only regarding paying Josh ASAP in full but also rei-valuate their lack of transparency.

    Unfortunately the majority of gaming venue owners in this industry don't give two hoots about anything until it impacts on their revenue. Take a stand again them and affect their income is the best way to get them to take notice and be accountable for their responsibilities.

    No offence to anyone but talk is only good if the other party is open to frank and honest communication - willing to take steps to resolve issue(s). Bet Phoenix doesn't seem to be motivated to do this.


    Cheers

    Dave
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2011
  20.  
    Nicolas-Johnson

    Nicolas-Johnson Affiliate Program Representative

    Messages:
    134
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    I make no excuse for our delay with Josh. I feel bad for what happened, it was certainly not what I would have chosen. I think none of us would have chosen what has happened to the US facing online gaming industry.

    Having said that, I'd like to say a few words based on CBG's statements.

    First and foremost, we have not made money. Our operations haven't even covered all our costs and losses. This is the case for most operators right now. Even if you as affiliates have seen a decrease in profits, most US facing brands have lost money over the last year or two, not made. Fortunately we have a long term plan, which is why we are open and haven't shut down like all the other programs you condemn.

    Next, I'd like to clear up the apparent inconsistency between my statement that we are a large and stable operator and the delay this affiliate has experienced. I know it can seem like a lack of transparency, but it isn't. Let me explain.

    The reason for this is that the business of BetPhoenix.com is a profitable, large and very stable operation. We own our own land, building (a $5 million dollar building) and even made a multi million dollar investment in developing our own live casino. In fact, our building was built by our own construction company. Hardly a small white label.

    The owner is very wealthy and has money to cover all our liabilities easily. Having said that, there are contracts, partners and other factors involved which make it so that we, the sub brand BetPhoenixCasino.com, run on a budget. One that we must stick to.

    If our stand alone Rival post up business went down, we'd be able to pay all people involved. Just like the owner of our company has done in times past with companies that weren't even his but he bought up (you can research this and verify it). If you know about this industry, you'd know about him and that is why I have confidence in the people I'm associated with. Even if there have been rough times, I have trust and confidence in the people I'm currently associated to.

    I had explained this to CBG in private (I believe so, I could be mixing you up with someone else... it is hard to keep track with forum handles/msn handles/real names/affiliate handles ... which aren't always the same)


    And last, I'd like to address the comment on my resignation.

    If this move was a truly dishonest one, I would have resigned long ago. Yes I have obligations, but I value sleeping well at night, even if it would involve less material comforts. However, if it is simply a company dealing with an industry implosion, then it would be rather low of me to abandon my boss when he needs me the most. It would also be detrimental to my affiliates, since, if you can forgive me for a moment of vanity, I believe I can positively influence the probabilities of our casino being a success, and making more money for our affiliates. It is the rats that always jump ship first, and I'm no rat. I'm determined to work this out, as I believe that we can be a long term success.

    The industry is going through a tough time. Everyone is stressed and frustrated right now. Some will quit. I don't blame them. But I'm not going to abandon good people when they need me the most. You can call me a sell out for that, I don't care.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2011

Share This Page