MASSIVE Rev Share fees... WTF?

Discussion in 'Intertops' started by KasinoKing, Nov 16, 2010.

  1.  
    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    I don't know how I managed not to notice this before, but I've just seen Intertops are charging me a "Rev Share Admin Fee"... :confused:

    e.g. For October this fee was $120 and I ended up getting only $48.
    {Casino nett win was $600, so I should have earned $120, not $48}

    On checking, I see this fee has been made before... every month! (When I earned anything).
    There is no mention at all of this in their T&Cs; Anyone know what it's for?

    KK
     

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  2.  
    Engineer

    Engineer Super Moderator

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    It's a way for them to shave and keep more for themselves, that's all.

    Personally, I would drop them and promote someone else such as Mainstreet, C-Planet, Affactive, or Affiliate Edge. With Mainstreet, you can can earn a flat 40% immediately. If a player deposits and loses $600, you will receive $240. Right now you're only getting 8% with Intertops, which is completely ridiculous. What a ripoff. Even if they were paying you the 20% they advertise -- that's still too low, IMO.
     
  3.  
    WCD Admin

    WCD Admin Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    What a joke :eek: InterTops.... ok, won't be going down that road either. Thanks for bringing this to attention. I have plans KK, only to be taking flat media buys. I think it'd be wise if more affiliates go this route.

    There is a flip side to this - when folks take this route, the affiliate will be worth less and less because the only affiliates left will be those who make small change, and therefore the programs will run over them like never before as they become worth less and less.
     
  4.  
    grem

    grem Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    I thought intertops were good.

    It is like a service fee charged for making them money.
     
  5.  
    Guard Dog

    Guard Dog Guard Dog Staff Member

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    These type of fees are horrible and disturbing. We saw this trend not so long ago with the 'admin fee' and I am very sad to see Intertops (a reputable program) taking such a stiff fee for, as grem so eloquently put it, 'making them money'.

    Roman - can you speak to this? Intertops is notified upon post here, so should be watching the thread.
     
  6.  
    GamTrak

    GamTrak Google it and see

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    Oh Lord, please say it aint so. :(

    I'm using the old system and do not see an admin fee field, but that's not to say it's not there and I'm just missing it.

    I'm sure the wonderful Roman will let us know what is going on and I'm hopeful that this is not the norm.
     
  7.  
    GFPC

    GFPC BWIN IS ROGUE

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    This is why Aussie Dave said that shaving is ramped! I have felt that at least for the last year to 18 months. These fees are everywhere. All the top brands are doing them and its getting out of control.

    I gotta agree with WCD on this one!! Its time forget about rev share anymore with these Shaves and CPA is just as bad when everyone is considered to be part of a syndicate.

    Whats left?
     
  8.  
    dendrite

    dendrite Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    This has been going on for as long as I've been an affiliate - I stopped sending them traffic over a year ago for this exact reason. The 8-10% commission I was getting was not worth the time and effort I was putting in, despite the fact they do a pretty good job at retaining players

    I mentioned it on one of the GPWA threads discussing RTGs, but I think people missed it, as I didn't get a response...
     
  9.  
    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    A quick update:
    I e-mailed them yesterday and got a confusing response which didn't really explain what is going on. I've asked them to clarify.

    In the meantime, I've just checked all my monthly stats for the last 12 months, and every single month they paid me exactly 16%, not the 20% promised in their terms.
    The only exception was last month which was only 8%.
    The e-mail admitted this was a mistake, and they are looking into why it happened.

    Unless they come up with a really good reason for underpaying, I will be officially asking Guard Dog to move Intertops from Recommended to Rogue for breaching their own T&Cs. :(

    KK
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2010
  10.  
    Intertops

    Intertops Affiliate Program Representative

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    Hi All,

    Let me do some clarifications:

    • Intertops has launched the “old” affiliate program in 1998 and has not changed the terms of calculation since I am with the company (and will not, as it is no development is done on it)
    • Intertops has launched the new affiliate program in February 2007 and
    • We had an upgrade to the software in the middle of October that has caused some hiccups in the payments for October. Payments went out on November 4, but unfortunately not all were correct, we are currently going through all statistics, reconcile them and contact all affected Affiliates individually – KK is one of them.

    Please let me know, if you need any further information. You may contact me at affiliate@intertops.com or here in the forum.

    Best regards,
    Roman
     
  11.  
    GamTrak

    GamTrak Google it and see

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    Thanks for that info. Roman. :)

    I've tested your program and am happy with the results and since it's football season I hope I can generate a bit more income.

    It's to bad this glitch happened at a time when us affiliates are on edge about shaving. It's only because I have known and met you for a long time now that I'm just gonna say that I hope this can be explained in a way that affiliates will feel secure about Intertops.
     
  12.  
    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    Hi Roman! :emoticon-0128-hi:

    You know we've met a number of times and I think you are a great guy - one of the best in the business!
    So you'll know this is not personal, I'm just trying to get my head round this.

    I got a reply from your colleague which says:
    So I'm guessing that the "* 20%" is supposed to indicate that the "royalties" is a fixed 20% regardless.
    That is certainly how it works out; (Net Win - 20% Royalties) x 20% = 16% commission.

    What I don't get is how you can justify this 20% "royalties" charge and why it is not clearly explained in the terms? :confused:
    How can "Progressive Contributions and Payment Fees" add up to 20% consistently?
    And why do Intertops charge for these when no other RTG (that I promote) does?

    This really is very poor. I only just persuaded myself to promote you in the first place because 20% is so low, and now I find out it's really only 16%.
    Why would I send players to you for 16% when I could send them to any number of other RTGs for 25%, 30% or even 40% in some cases!
    I'm very disappointed in your company, and very angry at myself for not spotting this years ago! :mad:

    KK
     
  13.  
    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    Bump!
    Still waiting for an answer from Roman...
    PM sent 2 days ago - no reply. :(

    KK
     
  14.  
    Intertops

    Intertops Affiliate Program Representative

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    Hi All,

    Thanks for all your kind posts!

    I understand it as the following: Affiliates are running their own business (regardless of part time, full time or even with employees) and need to look after the interest of this business. Therefore, I would never take comments like this personally.


    Mark, we can always talk about affiliate commission percentage. I have sent you an e-mail. (On another note: Yesterday evening is not two days ago in my calendar :) )

    Best regards,
    Roman
     
  15.  
    justbookies

    justbookies Affiliate Guard Dog Member

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    So that is the definition of the 'rev share admin fee.'

    I get very significant deductions as well on 'parent net revenue' columns. A while back Intertops kindly gave me a clear definition of the parent net revenue:

    "The Parent net revenue is used to calculate the bonus. Please let me explain this with an example: A player deposits $100, receives a $50 bonus and loses all the money in the casino. Then the casino net revenue would display $150, and the parent net revenue would display -$50 (this figure is always negative). You then receive your share of the difference ($100), which was the initial deposit."

    What confuses my brain cell is that the 'rev share admin fee' includes a deduction for bonuses & the 'parent net revenue' is the deduction for bonuses. Are the bonuses being deducted in two places?
     
  16.  
    TheGamblingGuru

    TheGamblingGuru Turning Over Stones

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    Thanks to the other poster for reviving this thread.

    Roman, your explanation above appears as though it was never really clarified well...

    Was your initial post above in this thread incorrect? Or are we affiliates of Intertops only actually making a 16% rev share?

    ____
    ____
     
  17.  
    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    If you are on the base 20% deal, then yes, you will only actually get 16% after the "Admin Fee" is deducted.
    It's easy enough to check, if you just look at your stats for any earning month; Just divide your Commission by the Net Revenue & multiply by 100 to get the %.
    ( See my screenshot in the first post of this thread - though note that the commission in that month SHOULD have been $96, not $48 )

    KK
     
  18.  
    sportsbettor

    sportsbettor New Member

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    Okay i just saw it too, after i opened up the website and got my first referral.
     
  19.  
    Guard Dog

    Guard Dog Guard Dog Staff Member

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    This is a REALLY old thread - are you sure Intertops is doing this? They are pretty respectable these days.
     
  20.  
    KasinoKing

    KasinoKing Player turned affiliate.

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    Yes they are.
    They still deduct a flat 20% "Admin Fee" from the casino's Net Win.
    Not worth promoting them unless you negotiate a much higher Rev-Share % - which is what I did years ago! :cool:

    KK
     

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