AGD Sponsor Criteria

[AussieDave]

Edit: Interesting name - SlotJoint, lets hope it stays that way

Even at 97.86% RTP, with WR of Bx40 the expected loss is 85% of the bonus funds = a tiny profit for any "bonus abusers".
With your lower than average max bet of $4 there is no way anyone could systematically "abuse" anything!

Even with single zero roulette (a HA of 2.70%) - the expected loss is 108% of the bonus funds.
Again, with a max bet of $4, I would LOVE to hear how people can abuse that!
If it were me I would allow Roulette at 50% or more in WR.

Anyway, you can do what you want - I'm just giving you my feedback from a PLAYER perspective.

Granted AGD is an affiliate forum and not a player forum. However, without players we make nothing.

Correct me if I'm wrong here... BUT most affiliates, myself included, expected FULL transparency. Hence I don't think it's being pedantic to expect the casinos(s) which potential sponsors represent, that their T&C's etc relating to players, should also be included in the overall evaluation and accreditation process.

 

[Guard Dog]

ok guys. I had to move the post because we are basically mucking up what is a welcome thread by posting other topics.


There is nothing wrong with their bonus outside the fact that *SOME* people do not like it. That is NOT a jab, BTW. It is a fact. They have players playing that bonus without issue. But honestly - I don't care about that. Bonuses are not and never will be part of AGD criteria. You can clearly see what our criteria are when you go to the homepage and go to the designated page. That's what we care about. A bonus is not.

Yeah, I care about players. And players have choices. They can choose NOT to take a bonus. Just like I choose NOT to take a bonus when playing at any casino. Just like I choose NOT to take a bonus when playing at Fanduel or Draftkings. I choose not because I do not want to subscribe to the terms even if they are 'ok'.

I don't know what you are talking about at all with this 'FULL transparency' comment. We don't do player terms. We never have. We never will.


Andy

 

[AussieDave]

I see you didn't move KK's post though...
Seriously dude if you have a problem with me posting my valid concerns, then just say so. And I'd appreciate that being said in public and NOT via being told via a PM to cool it or get a 30 day vacation...

To move my post and to start a new-thread with it, takes it completely out-of-context.

I have to wonder why most post about the "truth" concern you... just sayin.

 

[Guard Dog]

I didn't move KKs post because it was already responded to. Your concern isn't valid, IMO, we don't do that. We never have. Bonuses are optional to a player anyway... You don't like them, you don't take them.

Not sure what the public vs PM comment is about.

Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk

 

[bonustreak]

Bonus complaints belong on a player based forum period... CM is where that type of stuff is talked about not on an affiliate forum.

 

[Kristine]

Hello again

The about page at SlotJoint Casino states its values: Integrity, Respect and Quality. We even created an automatic flushing feature as a responsible gaming feature and recommend it to our players.

SlotJoint's terms and conditions reflect these values and are fully transparent. None of the terms are hard to find and none of the terms are omitted, misleading or intentionally deceptive. SlotJoint Casino wrote its terms in good faith and made them as clear and as transparent as possible. Additionally, bonus terms are incorporated throughout the player journey. See these examples:
http://exclusive.slotjoint.com/Reviews/BonusTerms.PNG
http://exclusive.slotjoint.com/Reviews/HomePage.PNG
http://exclusive.slotjoint.com/Reviews/WelcomeBack.PNG
http://exclusive.slotjoint.com/Reviews/Contributionrates.PNG

As previously mentioned most multi-vendor casinos have separate contribution classes for volatile and / or high RTP games, e.g. LeoVegas has a 70% class, Guts 75%, Betat 50%. In my opinion, as long as this fact is disclosed and can be easily found then full WR transparency is achieved. Do you disagree?

Bonuses need to be set to be profitable, don't you agree? Too high of a WR and it turns away players or pisses them off, too low and it’s unprofitable. What is bad about hitting that WR sweet spot? As I said earlier we had over 5,000 players since October 2015 and not a single deposit bonus WR related complaint. We have given out hundreds of free chips in exchange for feedback and not a single player mentioned an issue with our deposit bonus WR.

We hope to bring you in and create a mutually beneficial long-term partnership

 

[AussieDave]

Hi Kristina,
For the record, I have no beef with you... Thanks for posting the above...

I am however very disappointed that once again, I've been discriminated against by AGD/Andy et al, for airing my honest opinions. I don't see either of KK's scathing player protection posts in this thread. Nope only mine and mine wasn't taking pot shots at the affiliate program. Oh that's right I'm not a Mod... oops my bad

The fact my post was quickly swept under the carpet per se and effectively hidden, makes what happened even worse.

If you don't want people to share their honest opinions, then don't have a forum, simple!

You want to build the membership base up Andy, well here's a thought!...Instead of posting the equivalent of sugar-coated paid endorsements, write a respectable and credible review with shining merits of Pros and Cons. Maybe then, the NEW members you seek, will consider AGD a worthwhile place to hang their hat.

 

[Guard Dog]

mod has nothing to do with it. As I mentioned, KKs post was responded to. Hard to move a thread once it has context. Yours was not - easier to move. No discrimination at all. Not sure how it was 'swept under the carpet' either as it is publicly posted and moved.

I guess we can't do anything right in your eyes, Dave.

Maybe you should go to GPWA where they do everything right?

 

[PaaskeUK]

I agree with Dave here. And yeah he used KK's post as well to comment on so why move Dave's post to a seperate thread? If you make a move like that Andy then you might as well had taken KK's comments as well. I know KK is a great guy and always looks at things from a player's perspective which is a great and important way to do things.

And yes that should be the same rules for Affiliate Programs. What does it matter if the affiliate program has great terms and looks great if the casino or casino's terms are not good for a player? I feel its fair for these comments to have a discussion about it.

But yes Andy it is your forum here and of course you are the boss. But to make WagerJoint a AGD Certified Sponsor is maybe bit hasty and some of the other programs this year. I have not done this post about WagerJoint but just to discuss this subject.

I have an idea how about new affiliate programs come on as a test trial first where we affiliates can look at their terms for the casinos they offer etc. And then could do a voting or just do it as at casinomeister where casinos gets a "Baptism By Fire".

Give them the trial and see how things pan out. THEN give them the AGD Certified Sponsor.

This way we also get a chance to discuss terms for their casinos here and they can help modify maybe and make few changes so its perfect for all parts.

Hope my post makes sense as written this a bit hasty. I just want to make sure my words comes out right how does it sound?

To finish off about your rant with Dave. And telling him go to GPWA? I think this is exactly why he feels hurt. GPWA is BS. We want AGD to carry on as what you actually started Andy and not end up AGD becoming like GPWA as that's how it now looks in my own eyes.

 

[cassaon888]

I agree with Dave here. And yeah he used KK's post as well to comment on so why move Dave's post to a seperate thread? If you make a move like that Andy then you might as well had taken KK's comments as well. I know KK is a great guy and always looks at things from a player's perspective which is a great and important way to do things.

And yes that should be the same rules for Affiliate Programs. What does it matter if the affiliate program has great terms and looks great if the casino or casino's terms are not good for a player? I feel its fair for these comments to have a discussion about it.

But yes Andy it is your forum here and of course you are the boss. But to make WagerJoint a AGD Certified Sponsor is maybe bit hasty and some of the other programs this year. I have not done this post about WagerJoint but just to discuss this subject.

I have an idea how about new affiliate programs come on as a test trial first where we affiliates can look at their terms for the casinos they offer etc. And then could do a voting or just do it as at casinomeister where casinos gets a "Baptism By Fire".

Give them the trial and see how things pan out. THEN give them the AGD Certified Sponsor.

This way we also get a chance to discuss terms for their casinos here and they can help modify maybe and make few changes so its perfect for all parts.

Hope my post makes sense as written this a bit hasty. I just want to make sure my words comes out right how does it sound?

To finish off about your rant with Dave. And telling him go to GPWA? I think this is exactly why he feels hurt. GPWA is BS. We want AGD to carry on as what you actually started Andy and not end up AGD becoming like GPWA as that's how it now looks in my own eyes.

I couldn't have said it better.

 

[cassaon888]

Edit: Interesting name - SlotJoint, lets hope it stays that way



Granted AGD is an affiliate forum and not a player forum. However, without players we make nothing.

Correct me if I'm wrong here... BUT most affiliates, myself included, expected FULL transparency. Hence I don't think it's being pedantic to expect the casinos(s) which potential sponsors represent, that their T&C's etc relating to players, should also be included in the overall evaluation and accreditation process.

Bet4You makes a very valid point here. I always have a look at the operator side of things first before I start crafting a casino review. It defeats the object somewhat if you have a great affiliate program but lousy operator. In my opinion it can lead to 'ambiguous' advertising.

 

[casinonewbie]

Honestly i don't even know why Bet4You even bothers here, this agro has been going on for a long time. Dave supplies endless amounts of quality content on a regular basis for this forum & yes some is not sugar coated, what are we all still playing in the sand pit! He provides helpful sincere advice to many other affiliates, when he starts asking one too many tough questions he gets a big kick in the guts by Andy. Dave is not a lacky & his straight shooting style is obviously not wanted around here. How dare you express your opinions, help many affiliates out & ask the hard questions Bet4You

 

[KasinoKing]

I would like to apologise to all concerned for starting this all off by posting while "a little drunk".

I AM very passionate about Welcome Bonuses as I think they are KEY in securing the maximum number of conversions, and of course, I was a successful "Bonus Hunter" myself for 5 years before becoming an affiliate (and for another 5 years afterwards!).
However, alcohol enhanced or not, there was no excuse for the strength of language I used in the other thread and I have now edited the post to tone it down.

So again, sorry to everyone (especially WagerJoint) - in future I will think thrice about posting while under the influence!

KK

 

[Guard Dog]

To finish off about your rant with Dave. And telling him go to GPWA? I think this is exactly why he feels hurt. GPWA is BS. We want AGD to carry on as what you actually started Andy and not end up AGD becoming like GPWA as that's how it now looks in my own eyes.

I'm not quite sure how we look like GPWA. I do not take just any sponsor. When I take a sponsor - it means they qualify on all criteria listed in our document (which is completely transparent and online).

I can only follow my own ethics and feelings. I've done this from day 1. I don't even have unilateral decisions. There have been times when I felt programs could be certified, but the certification team was against it. Hence - not certified. We included CasinoMeister ratings some time back to make sure the casinos were not considered sketchy or rogue. I search through CM and AG now to make sure the casinos are ok.

Basically - I am doing my best in regards to making sure the programs have both good casinos and good terms. But terms are what we do here. I included the other stuff at the request of members.

As far as Dave.... Yes, I got a bit testy with him. I tried to have a discussion in my first post that was a take off on his argument for bonus terms being part of our criteria. I didn't insult him or anyone else. In my second post I only responded to him even though he was having a 'go' at me. The 3rd post I got angry. I'm human. Dave criticizes every move I make despite that I try to do things right by affiliates. Despite the fact that I created AGD in order to make sure we are all safe from terms changes. Yeah, it is frustrating. I'm sorry.

These are real questions:

* Should I stay out of the forums since I am the owner?

* Should I stop sponsorships alltogether? Let the current ones play out and then only certify?


Other than this thread, I am bowing out for awhile. As I said... done my best. I will concentrate elsewhere.

 

[slotplayer]

I learned years ago not to second guess the management.
It's Andy's ship, he can run it the way he sees fit, just like I run my ship the way I see fit.

 

[cassaon888]

As far as Dave.... Yes, I got a bit testy with him. I tried to have a discussion in my first post that was a take off on his argument for bonus terms being part of our criteria. I didn't insult him or anyone else. In my second post I only responded to him even though he was having a 'go' at me. The 3rd post I got angry. I'm human. Dave criticizes every move I make despite that I try to do things right by affiliates. Despite the fact that I created AGD in order to make sure we are all safe from terms changes. Yeah, it is frustrating. I'm sorry.

Duly noted and thanks!

I might be wrong here but I sense that there might be mutual respect. Thing is I understand exactly where Dave is coming from, as a seasoned affiliate he's seen the same old song and dance many times before. His initial comment was specifically geared towards 'KK's' observation. Dave's choice of words might not always be the best, as one member rightfully said: ''he shoots from the hip''. He calls a spade a spade and gets straight to the point. No dilly dally here.

I agree with both of them that the bonus terms of SlotJoint might not always be in the best interest of the player. As players we look at it from both ways and from a different angle. You get some operators that are so malicious they'll put a rattle snake in a player's pocket and ask for a match.

Any way, Wagerjoint welcome to AGD. Per chance you don't have any ties to the old Wagerjunction program?

These are real questions:

* Should I stay out of the forums since I am the owner?

No why should you, you're the captain of this ship. It's like telling Donald Trump to stay away from Trump Entertainment Resorts.

* Should I stop sponsorship all together? Let the current ones play out and then only certify?

No don't. I hold your site in high esteem (one of the few good ones left). It would be nice though if we can give constructive feedback: not only about the operator's program but to discuss the operator itself from a player's point of view: bonus terms, are progressive wins included in the withdrawal limit, types of vendors employed, any previous player complaints against it, who the owners are (transparency), which jurisdiction the operator is licensed in etc. Basically, something similar to that of Casinomeister's 'Baptism by Fire'.

Other than this thread, I am bowing out for awhile. As I said... done my best. I will concentrate elsewhere.

You certainly are, once again this is not necessary. I decided to become more active on this forum because I know that you're on to something good here.

 

[bonustreak]

First off I think that maybe moving Dave's post over was something that was done in hast. I know Dave is a pain at times but he also does great things for others as well. He has helped me a few times in private with some hacking issues etc.
I think many times folks post in haste because we are all so busy with your home lives and our business. We rush to say things that maybe we should step back and think before we post. I don't think anyone should leave the forum either.
I think that maybe there needs to be a new criteria standard set so that everyone is happy. We def do not want this forum to become another GPWA!

 

[AussieDave]

Dave criticizes every move I make

That feeling is mutual. It's got to the point where if I make a post that challenges a program's ethics or something that's clearly unfair, your following me with BBQ and tongs in hand. It's not my fault if, lets say, an AM wants to play semantics & or evade answering a direct question.

Yet I get fried for trying to 'keep the bastards honest'...

---------

Lets get one thing straight here...I don't begrudge AGD or Andy making money from this site. It's not cheap to run a dedi server or to employ web developers etc and AGD is a business after all.

What does get my goat up... There seems to be a huge push lately to take paid sponsors. Now reiterating I don't begrudge the forum bringing in cash.

However, there are program terms which are long overdue for an update, threads where members post about not being paid or having difficulty contacting the "certified" program, yet 1, 2 or even 3 months can drift past before a Mod or Admin actually pulls their finger out and posts to the thread with help. Worse, these member problems are allowed to continue going undressed (I've seen threads were it's over 12 months and still the issue remains). Yet the program STILL retains its certified status, with banners flying too.

Adding, it's a totally different story if an AGD Admin or Mod's hasn't been paid or has an issue with a certified program...just sayin.

In my usually non-sugared-coated style... Lets not BS each other here...
If AGD didn't have members like myself and others who post fresh content etc, then it would be a pretty quite place.

It's a two way street, you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours...
There's got to be some give and support, otherwise, members start to feel like canon fodder.

EDIT:
We've ALL got 2 choices here... We can take what's happen and think of it as a negative or take it as a positive and try to work through it, coming out the other-side with a mutual respect for each other. At the end of the days it's not about who's right or wrong, it's about what's fair for everyone involved

 

[Guard Dog]

A huge push to take sponsors? Really?

On one count, not your business. On second count... I think 3 in a year wouldn't be a huge push.

On second count, we have a certification team AND a set of criteria. If I put up 10 sponsors in a year, it shouldn't matter, right?


I'm at my daughter's dance class and felt I had to respond simply because it seems to me you want to control what AGD does. I've done nothing wrong here, but am under fire. I took in a quality sponsor, shoot me, lol. I have a certification team so there can be no unilateral decisions, shoot me again. With that team, we got a couple of sponsors, I should be executed.

Man... Maybe GPWA has it right. They take whoever they want, everyone knows that's just how it is, they make a ton of money, their forums thrive, and nobody can tell them how they should run their business.

I do things the right way... Get slammed and pushed around not only by programs who hate that I won't let them sponsor or give them predatory status.. But also by the affiliates I am trying to protect.

My ass hurts

Anyway.. On the lighter side of things. I'm going to watch my daughter dance.



Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk

 

[AussieDave]

Andy...
Reiterating... The Problem is not the Problem: the problem is your attitude about the problem.

Clearly I'm wasting my time here.